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Servitor Hive


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#1 amitabhisgood

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 05:35 PM

On another thread there was mention of servitor hive or something like that in tune with bee hives.

It is possible to make a hive of servitors or network of servitors having powerful combined effect while individual effect on reality is restricted to one or few functionality?
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#2 Shinichi

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 11:08 PM

I've observed and on a minor scale done similar things with psionic constructs, so it's technically possible. It just depends on what you want to do.

Also, though a bit different, the first though that came to mind when I read this was Ellis.



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Edited by Shinichi, 12 August 2014 - 11:08 PM.

"There is no such thing as Impossible. It's merely a matter of understanding the mechanisms by which the Will may be made manifest into an objective reality." -- The Wise

#3 TheCusp

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 12:12 AM

You could say the christian father son and holy spirit are a sort of power rangers megazord.

It's doable, but it would be a massive project, and you'd have to be sure you get all the pieces right. Seems like too large of an undertaking without some very clear reason to make one.
“Come in close. Closer. Because the more you think you see, the easier it’ll be to fool you. Because what is seeing? You’re looking, but what you’re really doing is filtering, interpreting, searching for meaning. My job? To take that most precious of gifts you give me, your attention, and use it against you.” - Now You See Me

#4 Shinichi

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 12:50 AM

Also, just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.

Occam's Razor has a lot of practical value in these things.



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#5 voidgazing

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 01:04 AM

Yes, you can. Why would you want to is the real question: what advantage would it confer and what disadvantages?
This is a postcard sent from the dining room of the HMS Russel's Teapot. Wish you were here- the band is spot on tonight, and we're having "all the way down" turtle soup!

#6 amitabhisgood

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 05:22 AM

Thanx all for the response. At present, "How?" is of priority over "Why?".

Referring back to the post mentioned on another thread, that discussion was about egregore where the egregore creation process involves additional expectations, petitions, desires getting added to initial intent(s).

If servitor hive is possible and doable, then a servitorhive become sort of specialist machine, IMHO.

Real question for me is "How?"
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#7 Shinichi

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 01:13 PM

How is directly related to why, because knowing what you want to achieve defines how you want to achieve it.

Showing you a map is not very useful if you don't know the name of the town you're trying to get to.



~:Shin:~
"There is no such thing as Impossible. It's merely a matter of understanding the mechanisms by which the Will may be made manifest into an objective reality." -- The Wise

#8 amitabhisgood

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:09 PM

View PostShinichi, on 13 August 2014 - 01:13 PM, said:

How is directly related to why, because knowing what you want to achieve defines how you want to achieve it.

Showing you a map is not very useful if you don't know the name of the town you're trying to get to.



~:Shin:~

Thanx Shin. Does an artist have to know "why" before knowing "how". Does the process change with the intent? I didn't find so with servitor creation process.

I want to know how to create a servitorhive. Is there any prevalent practice to create, develop and nurture a hive? If so, what is it? If not, then has anybody taken any step toward creating and would like to share general steps involved and if steps vary with "why", either through this thread or through PM. Its the "mechanism" I inquire about.
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#9 Shinichi

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:33 PM

View Postamitabhisgood, on 13 August 2014 - 03:09 PM, said:

Does an artist have to know "why" before knowing "how". Does the process change with the intent?

I'm glad your intuition inspired that particular question, since I am an artist.

When I write a poem, what it is about and why I am writing it is infinitely more important than the method, or the final structure, or the mechanics.

When I draw a picture, the subject and emotion (the reason) behind the act of drawing is infinitely more important than the detailed mechanics of this line goes here, or that area needs to be shaded.

When I write a short story or a novel, the story itself, the content and why I want to write it, is infinitely more important than the detailed mechanics of pre-writing, writing, revision, and formatting.

So yes, the process does change with an intent. One poem may be best expressed with a classical Italian Sonnet, and another may be best expressed in my own unique style. And all of this is decided entirely by why I want to write that particular poem.

Three people have responded to this thread, each one has said a "hive" is possible, and each one said having a good reason or understanding why is more important than how to do it -- because a map will not be very useful to you if you don't know where you are trying to go.

Nobody is trying to keep any secrets from you that will be shared in pm, because the methods behind this particular endeavor is indeed rather simple. But depending on "why," it's also not the most practical thing to do.



~:Shin:~
"There is no such thing as Impossible. It's merely a matter of understanding the mechanisms by which the Will may be made manifest into an objective reality." -- The Wise

#10 amitabhisgood

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 04:12 PM

Cool.

Why?: I want to create, develop and nurture a hive to stop snoring when a person reach deep sleep.

Now, how do I create, develop and nurture a hive for this intent?

Why?: I want to practice the generic process to create, develop and nurture hive.
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#11 amitabhisgood

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 04:17 PM

View PostShinichi, on 13 August 2014 - 03:33 PM, said:


When I write a poem, what it is about and why I am writing it is infinitely more important than the method, or the final structure, or the mechanics.

When I draw a picture, the subject and emotion (the reason) behind the act of drawing is infinitely more important than the detailed mechanics of this line goes here, or that area needs to be shaded.

When I write a short story or a novel, the story itself, the content and why I want to write it, is infinitely more important than the detailed mechanics of pre-writing, writing, revision, and formatting.

Poet has to know to arrange words in sequence, before the why of the theme gets started.
One who draws a picture should know to sharpen the pencil (or hold a brush) even before awareness of emotion arise.
One who writes a short story need know writing, the language, the semantics, the syntax even before considering the content.
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#12 voidgazing

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 04:46 PM

Quote

I want to create, develop and nurture a hive to stop snoring when a person reach deep sleep.

A hive may not be the best way. You are speaking of matters of health- those are best approached hollistically. Think about it like this: there are a nearly infinite number of ways to stop someone from snoring. Most of them also involve a cessation of breathing.

A single function entity that does not see or act outside of its very simple purpose does not have the capacity to care which one of those ways you think is best.
This is a postcard sent from the dining room of the HMS Russel's Teapot. Wish you were here- the band is spot on tonight, and we're having "all the way down" turtle soup!

#13 R. Eugene Laughlin

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 06:45 PM

View Postvoidgazing, on 13 August 2014 - 04:46 PM, said:


A single function entity that does not see or act outside of its very simple purpose does not have the capacity to care which one of those ways you think is best.

Perhaps, but hives usually have seekers and gatherers. Sometimes they go out in random directions and look for new sources of what they want. When they find it they bring some back and tell the others where they got it. That could be useful.
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#14 TheCusp

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 11:29 PM

Few things overwhelm attention like a swarm.
“Come in close. Closer. Because the more you think you see, the easier it’ll be to fool you. Because what is seeing? You’re looking, but what you’re really doing is filtering, interpreting, searching for meaning. My job? To take that most precious of gifts you give me, your attention, and use it against you.” - Now You See Me

#15 z0b

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 12:43 AM

there is a good chance they will stop the snoring alright easiest way would be to kill the sleeper remember spirits always take the easiest path for them so I would put some more thought into your idea.

#16 amitabhisgood

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 05:01 AM

Thanx for the responses.

So the 'Why?' becomes

Why?: {I want to} create, develop and nurture a hive to stop snoring when a person reach deep sleep. The hive should use peaceful, healthy, life generating and/or sustaining ways to stop the person from snoring while in sleep and/or deep sleep. The hive should use methods and run processes on the person while awake or asleep, that are life sustaining and modulate metabolism for desired outcome. The hive should procure peaceful life sustaining resources from outside sources toward fulfillment of desired outcome, as required. The hive should be submissive to the creator and/or any other entity assigned by the creator to manage it.
Anything else to add??
Statement of intent (otherwise known as 'Why?') can be elaborated with ifs and ifnots.

Next what?
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#17 Shinichi

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 01:54 PM

View Postamitabhisgood, on 13 August 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

Poet has to know to arrange words in sequence, before the why of the theme gets started.
One who draws a picture should know to sharpen the pencil (or hold a brush) even before awareness of emotion arise.
One who writes a short story need know writing, the language, the semantics, the syntax even before considering the content.

You're parroting the ideas of an emotionless textbook. The thoughts and feelings of experienced artists everywhere disagree with such ideas, and for good reason. There's no point learning technicalities if you don't know why you want to use them. Why waste my time learning how to paint if I don't want to paint something? It's after answering that question that I start learning method or move on to something else.

View Postamitabhisgood, on 14 August 2014 - 05:01 AM, said:

Thanx for the responses.

So the 'Why?' becomes

Why?: {I want to} create, develop and nurture a hive to stop snoring when a person reach deep sleep. The hive should use peaceful, healthy, life generating and/or sustaining ways to stop the person from snoring while in sleep and/or deep sleep. The hive should use methods and run processes on the person while awake or asleep, that are life sustaining and modulate metabolism for desired outcome. The hive should procure peaceful life sustaining resources from outside sources toward fulfillment of desired outcome, as required. The hive should be submissive to the creator and/or any other entity assigned by the creator to manage it.
Anything else to add??
Statement of intent (otherwise known as 'Why?') can be elaborated with ifs and ifnots.

Next what?

Is there any particular reason you can't accomplish these goals with a single servitor instead of a hive, or with something far more simple? With such a simple problem as snoring, I think even one servitor is overkill, much less a hive of them.

But you stubbornly want a hive, so now that you know what the hive will be doing, next you need to think about why you need more than one servitor doing it. That is, after all, the definition of a hive -- a group of things working together with one mind. So, how many different kinds of servitors will make up the hive? What will each of them be doing?

See, this sort of thing is complex. It's a bit like a Class in C++, you have one big group of code (the hive) doing one big thing, and a bunch of Functions (servitors) within it doing different parts of that thing.

Which is why the necessity of such a project must be questioned.



~:Shin:~
"There is no such thing as Impossible. It's merely a matter of understanding the mechanisms by which the Will may be made manifest into an objective reality." -- The Wise

#18 amitabhisgood

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 03:02 PM

View PostShinichi, on 14 August 2014 - 01:54 PM, said:

Is there any particular reason you can't accomplish these goals with a single servitor instead of a hive, or with something far more simple? With such a simple problem as snoring, I think even one servitor is overkill, much less a hive of them.
Thanx for the response.

As informed earlier, my objective is to know the mechanics of creating a hive servitor.

A "Why?" has been added later as there was a persistence among the responses that a "Why?:" is must and I found that to move further in search of the mechanics involved, a "Why?:" has become important.

Every problem is a problem. What is simple to one person is mind-boggling to another. Yeah, a servitor is not "required" to stop the other person from snoring.....just slap that person awake...thats it. Similarly servitor is not required at all for getting customer....just go around the whole day using old-school sales methods. This isn't about whether servitor is required or not. Its about the mechanics involved in creating a hive. But then members here want a "Why?:" to be mentioned. :( :huh:


View PostShinichi, on 14 August 2014 - 01:54 PM, said:

See, this sort of thing is complex. It's a bit like a Class in C++, you have one big group of code (the hive) doing one big thing, and a bunch of Functions (servitors) within it doing different parts of that thing.

Coming over to technicality part. My query since beginning has been what is the underlying mechanics involved in creating a hive.

To put it in other words, if hive is to be considered as component, then what are the subcomponents?

I have reservations with considering a hive to be a "class" and servitors to be "functions". But then I am inquisitive to know if it really so at conceptual levels.
More important is the initial query about the mechanics and internal programming flow involved in creating a hive servitor. What are the subcomponents of hive servitor? How is a hive servitor different from a non-hive servitor? What considerations (besides the why?: part) should be considered while designing a hive?
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#19 z0b

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 05:35 PM

A very romantic notion the truth is they are to be a creation of your will limited by your ability to put into the construct the fact is the more you put in the least you will be able to influence any outcomes of the creation.How do you intend to feed this lifeform if you are not creative enough you will tie it to you then it will see you and others in time as food Im not saying don't or you can't do such a thing but think it through a bit man other wise you will bring much unforeseen to you and possibly others.

Edited by z0b, 14 August 2014 - 05:38 PM.


#20 voidgazing

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 08:24 PM

Conceptually you can look at it as processes if you want to use a programming metaphor instead of insects :-)

The difference between a regular servitor and a hive/modular servitor is that the hive has little pieces of specialized awareness and task completion controlled by a centralized structure (your hive OS). The advantage to it is that you can add and remove those components as you need to with a minimum of effort and fuss. A modular servitor isn't generally as 'aware' as a regular servitor- its more like a dumb machine in my own (admittedly limited) experience.

So this is why we asked why- because a health problem demands awareness a hive usually lacks. The form of the hive will largely be dictated by what you want it to do, you see?

Go with something like 'keep my home happy and running well' instead of the snoring. Subtasks can be delegated relatively easily to hive-processes and nobody is going to stop breathing :-D
This is a postcard sent from the dining room of the HMS Russel's Teapot. Wish you were here- the band is spot on tonight, and we're having "all the way down" turtle soup!





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