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On Why I Want To Study The Lhp And Not The Right


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#1 Nameless

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 06:24 AM

This text is made mostly as a request to be criticized upon the reasons I have to follow this path, If anyone finds faults in my logic or my understanding of what the left hand path means, please tell me.
First of all, I don´t want to follow a path which seeks being absorbed by the ain soph, what is the real use in your life if all you want is to gather with the nothingness?
The LHP seeks to become stronger in this world and boost your ego, not destroy it; your main aim is to become wiser.
The LHP is about self-deification, not bending your knees before a certain god, who cares too little about your goals or intentions.
The LHP is about critical thinking and requesting the “whys” of things, not following a certain book because some authority said so. Morality is something you decide upon, choosing upon what you believe to be correct.
The LHP has a Darwinian mindset, which means the survival of the fittest; “blessed are the strong and cursed are the weak”.


Did I miss something important, did I confuse some concept of the path?
There might be other factors involved, for example, Harab Serapel , could be understood as a rejection of love.
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#2 Nalyd Khezr Bey

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 08:49 AM

Now can you throw all of that out and set out on your own? Or do you feel you really need to adhere to this crutch? Why do you feel the need to post this and get criticism? Aren't you strong enough to just go with it even if it is just downright stupid and typical?

#3 Nameless

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 09:38 AM

Given that my ideas where incorrect, then I would use any criticism to meditate upon them in order to improve; I have no problem with criticism, since I tend to take it from a rational standpoint most of the time. I don´t "need" to adhere to this, I think like this naturally.

What do you mean by stupid and typical?
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#4 z0b

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 09:53 AM

Be as you are and have fun on your path

#5 Nalyd Khezr Bey

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 11:10 AM

View PostNameless, on 29 November 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

Given that my ideas where incorrect, then I would use any criticism to meditate upon them in order to improve; I have no problem with criticism, since I tend to take it from a rational standpoint most of the time. I don´t "need" to adhere to this, I think like this naturally.

What do you mean by stupid and typical?
All ideas are incorrect. What do you think "stupid and typical" means? Does it bother you that I used those terms to describe what you posted?

#6 RoseRed

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 01:45 PM

Quote

1 - First of all, I don´t want to follow a path which seeks being absorbed by the ain soph, what is the real use in your life if all you want is to gather with the nothingness?

2 - The LHP seeks to become stronger in this world and boost your ego, not destroy it; your main aim is to become wiser.

3 - The LHP is about self-deification, not bending your knees before a certain god, who cares too little about your goals or intentions.

4 - The LHP is about critical thinking and requesting the “whys” of things, not following a certain book because some authority said so. Morality is something you decide upon, choosing upon what you believe to be correct.

5 - The LHP has a Darwinian mindset, which means the survival of the fittest; “blessed are the strong and cursed are the weak”.


Let's get the obvious out of the way first. 'Not bending your knees before a certain god' and 'not following a certain book'. I think it's safe to assume that you're talking about the bible and the god of the Jews who thinks all people are sheep. It appears that there is a problem here with Christianity and the main tenets of it. A lot of people go to the opposite extreme of what they either don't like or are walking away from. I've seen it countless times on numerous forums and in real life. There's no judgement here. It happens.



1 - Gathering with the nothingness. Some people find nothing. Some people find something. If you've tried it and found nothing then perhaps it's not the right path for you or not the right path for right now. Perhaps it's the wrong path for this entire life. Who knows? I don't. Just because you found 'nothing' - that doesn't mean that others have not found 'something'.

So, you're looking for 'something'.



2 - You want to boost your ego and become wiser. Why does your ego need boosting? What do you believe is lacking that you need to boost it?

- Wisdom comes with experience. Knowledge can be easy to come by, especially in the digital age, but wisdom - that takes time and it's never handed to you.



3 - So you think that specific god doesn't care enough about you and you want to rise above the level of being a sheep. Cool. I don't think he cares all that much either. Sheep are good for making yarn. I've also heard they make a great stew.

Just keep in mind - none of the other gods are going to care that much about you either.



4 - You have a problem with authority and want answers instead of just being told what to do. A lot of people do.

- Morality does have a set definition. http://www.merriam-w...ionary/morality You don't get to pick and choose what is 'moral'. That's already been decided. You CAN choose to do whatever you want. You can filter it through any belief system you like. You don't have to choose to be 'moral' by the set definition of the word. Can you do so without guilt?



5 - So go take a martial arts class. Make yourself one of fittest that will survive. Survival of the fittest isn't about who has the most esoteric knowledge. It's about who can take what they need from those that are weaker and survive in hostile conditions. It's about who can adapt to different and/or changing situations. It's about passing on your genetics for the next generation.

Seriously - take a martial arts class. Knowing that you are able to defend and protect yourself and those you love will boost your ego. You want to survive? Then learn how.



This whole post comes across as you desperately searching for something to help you change yourself. You think you're not smart enough, not sure enough of yourself, you see yourself as weak and want to change all of that. It reads as if you're going through a rebellious stage but aren't confident enough to do it without the permission of others. It's no different than the tarot reading thread.

'If only the strong survive and are blessed'. The strong don't let parasites feast on them while they're sleeping. The don't allow the weak to eat at the life force and energy reserves like an all you can eat buffet. They know that in order to remain strong - they must keep what reserves they have and add to and replenish them - not exchange it away for a pleasant dream.

You asked for criticism. I've tried to give you constructive criticism and not be hurtful. I hope that I've achieved that.


Just think on these...

- Why do you feel that you must choose the right or the left path? Why do you think you need to follow a set standard written down by someone else?

- Why can you not choose your own goals and pursue them any way you want to?

- Why are you so willing to throw out and entire half (the right side) to get what you want?

- Once your goal is in sight, why can't you leave the 'path' and blaze your own trail?

- Why do you feel so stuck to only being able to achieve your goals this one specific way?

- You know what you want. Why don't you get out of your head and off your ass and do it?
When my wings get tired I grab my broom.

#7 meaculpa

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 02:15 PM

To me it seems like everything is about to be done out of rebellion (when it comes to the OP)...which a lot of understand. BUT, the LHP is kinda there to contradict the Christianity and mainstream religions, no?
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#8 omera

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 02:22 PM

View Postmeaculpa, on 29 November 2013 - 02:15 PM, said:

contradict the Christianity and mainstream religions, no?

I started using Angels, they're as evil as the other sort.

I'm a self declared mini-sultan with an appreciation for Islam but I'm also 'LHP'.

'rebellion' is a start but not the goal.


Nowadays, its hard to see the difference between 'ego' and 'my will be done'. My anger has yet to backlash, its an ox I ride under control. My hate, my envy, my ambition: all of these are the reason I am still here, still strong, and strong-er.

I don't understand peoples ideas of 'ego'. I don't see it as a centralized construct- maybe my only 'ego attachment' which has developed is the obsession with the black arts itself, while years of isolation allowed all else to fade away.


I don't believe in a karmic force: To alter the chemicals of a screaming, self-destructive twat so that they may never achieve bliss again is energetically less impacting upon the natural world than ripping a hole in the atmosphere or the Earth's crust.

Edited by omera, 29 November 2013 - 02:25 PM.

Spide"Cadius the Swift was only a slave, but under the wing of the emperor he was given the highest treatment a slave of messaging could acquire. He descended down the spiraled staircase of that dungeonesque castle and nodded to the guards as he was allowed out. He passed out of the Court of the Black Senate and beyond the defending walls surrounding the tower. The massive structure's only gate groaned wide open, a yawning maw announcing the departure of a traveler from the keep. Necessarily, the gate -was- a maw. As Cadius lightfootedly passed down the main street of Roma Diabolus, he got one glorious look at the daemonic head of Plutonicus glaring out idealistically toward the city's main gate and the vast expanse of an infernally twisted market screamed and yelled about its products before Main Street jutted the black cobblestone tongue of that monstrous symbol into the womb of the world."

#9 meaculpa

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 02:30 PM

View Postomera, on 29 November 2013 - 02:22 PM, said:

I started using Angels, they're as evil as the other sort.

lol..well thats why I am saying this as well...for me all of it is together, like one big Yin Yang. What is good has bad in it, and vice versa (to simplify ish).

I agree that rebellion is a start, but not a goal. I am curious to follow OPs path and where it leads.
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#10 SuccubusSherry

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 02:41 PM

How about finding a white magician to oppose- he or she does the right pillar and you do the left pillar. That's something I keep coming across, and you could use it to learn about both the columns and balancing the forces between them.

#11 RoseRed

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 02:44 PM

Quote

My anger has yet to backlash, its an ox I ride under control. My hate, my envy, my ambition: all of these are the reason I am still here, still strong, and strong-er.

You're living it's backlash. You're just too close to the situation to see it objectively.
When my wings get tired I grab my broom.

#12 omera

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 03:34 PM

View PostRoseRed, on 29 November 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

You're living it's backlash. You're just too close to the situation to see it objectively.
Its called bipolar, and when I got out of the TRAILER PARK it subsided. I haven't been 'living' anything. Did you scry my life? Get the fuck out.
Spide"Cadius the Swift was only a slave, but under the wing of the emperor he was given the highest treatment a slave of messaging could acquire. He descended down the spiraled staircase of that dungeonesque castle and nodded to the guards as he was allowed out. He passed out of the Court of the Black Senate and beyond the defending walls surrounding the tower. The massive structure's only gate groaned wide open, a yawning maw announcing the departure of a traveler from the keep. Necessarily, the gate -was- a maw. As Cadius lightfootedly passed down the main street of Roma Diabolus, he got one glorious look at the daemonic head of Plutonicus glaring out idealistically toward the city's main gate and the vast expanse of an infernally twisted market screamed and yelled about its products before Main Street jutted the black cobblestone tongue of that monstrous symbol into the womb of the world."

#13 RoseRed

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 04:37 PM

Nope. I have not scryed your life. I have no desire to. I also have no need to. I just read your posts. They're much more telling than you realize. No need to tell me to get the fuck out of something I'm not in.

Why don't you stop using your illness as an excuse. Get your meds regulated and maybe then you can attempt to find something better than the life you have right now.
When my wings get tired I grab my broom.

#14 omera

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 05:05 PM

View PostRoseRed, on 29 November 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:



Why don't you stop using your illness as an excuse. Get your meds regulated and maybe then you can attempt to find something better than the life you have right now.

What excuse, what illness... I haven't even had a moodswing in weeks... The most I've noticed is I'm starting to see phantasms, either clairvoyance or a pre-lude to scitzo.
Spide"Cadius the Swift was only a slave, but under the wing of the emperor he was given the highest treatment a slave of messaging could acquire. He descended down the spiraled staircase of that dungeonesque castle and nodded to the guards as he was allowed out. He passed out of the Court of the Black Senate and beyond the defending walls surrounding the tower. The massive structure's only gate groaned wide open, a yawning maw announcing the departure of a traveler from the keep. Necessarily, the gate -was- a maw. As Cadius lightfootedly passed down the main street of Roma Diabolus, he got one glorious look at the daemonic head of Plutonicus glaring out idealistically toward the city's main gate and the vast expanse of an infernally twisted market screamed and yelled about its products before Main Street jutted the black cobblestone tongue of that monstrous symbol into the womb of the world."

#15 Nameless

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 06:41 PM

View PostNalyd Khezr Bey, on 29 November 2013 - 11:10 AM, said:

All ideas are incorrect. What do you think "stupid and typical" means? Does it bother you that I used those terms to describe what you posted?
Could you please elaborate on why they are incorrect?
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#16 Nameless

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 08:08 PM

View PostRoseRed, on 29 November 2013 - 01:45 PM, said:

Let's get the obvious out of the way first. 'Not bending your knees before a certain god' and 'not following a certain book'. I think it's safe to assume that you're talking about the bible and the god of the Jews who thinks all people are sheep. It appears that there is a problem here with Christianity and the main tenets of it. A lot of people go to the opposite extreme of what they either don't like or are walking away from. I've seen it countless times on numerous forums and in real life. There's no judgement here. It happens. 1 - Gathering with the nothingness. Some people find nothing. Some people find something. If you've tried it and found nothing then perhaps it's not the right path for you or not the right path for right now. Perhaps it's the wrong path for this entire life. Who knows? I don't. Just because you found 'nothing' - that doesn't mean that others have not found 'something'. So, you're looking for 'something'. 2 - You want to boost your ego and become wiser. Why does your ego need boosting? What do you believe is lacking that you need to boost it? - Wisdom comes with experience. Knowledge can be easy to come by, especially in the digital age, but wisdom - that takes time and it's never handed to you. 3 - So you think that specific god doesn't care enough about you and you want to rise above the level of being a sheep. Cool. I don't think he cares all that much either. Sheep are good for making yarn. I've also heard they make a great stew. Just keep in mind - none of the other gods are going to care that much about you either. 4 - You have a problem with authority and want answers instead of just being told what to do. A lot of people do. - Morality does have a set definition. http://www.merriam-w...ionary/morality You don't get to pick and choose what is 'moral'. That's already been decided. You CAN choose to do whatever you want. You can filter it through any belief system you like. You don't have to choose to be 'moral' by the set definition of the word. Can you do so without guilt? 5 - So go take a martial arts class. Make yourself one of fittest that will survive. Survival of the fittest isn't about who has the most esoteric knowledge. It's about who can take what they need from those that are weaker and survive in hostile conditions. It's about who can adapt to different and/or changing situations. It's about passing on your genetics for the next generation. Seriously - take a martial arts class. Knowing that you are able to defend and protect yourself and those you love will boost your ego. You want to survive? Then learn how. This whole post comes across as you desperately searching for something to help you change yourself. You think you're not smart enough, not sure enough of yourself, you see yourself as weak and want to change all of that. It reads as if you're going through a rebellious stage but aren't confident enough to do it without the permission of others. It's no different than the tarot reading thread. 'If only the strong survive and are blessed'. The strong don't let parasites feast on them while they're sleeping. The don't allow the weak to eat at the life force and energy reserves like an all you can eat buffet. They know that in order to remain strong - they must keep what reserves they have and add to and replenish them - not exchange it away for a pleasant dream. You asked for criticism. I've tried to give you constructive criticism and not be hurtful. I hope that I've achieved that. Just think on these... - Why do you feel that you must choose the right or the left path? Why do you think you need to follow a set standard written down by someone else? - Why can you not choose your own goals and pursue them any way you want to? - Why are you so willing to throw out and entire half (the right side) to get what you want? - Once your goal is in sight, why can't you leave the 'path' and blaze your own trail? - Why do you feel so stuck to only being able to achieve your goals this one specific way? - You know what you want. Why don't you get out of your head and off your ass and do it?

My questions related to this subject, are for the most part, because I can´t claim an expertise on this area yet, even less with a path I am starting to fully understand. This thread was made to identify possible causes for the last thread related to the entities, and given that someone had some hate towards my mindset, to allow him/her to vent; I suffer not for being judged, so you need not to apologize.

Now despite you stating, the entities, could fuck up with me, I STILL, continued with the ritual I had scheduled.I do not feel weak, and I think they already know that, but, I wanted to make sure what the reasons for their visit was.

My questions are not made out of insecurity but rather of ignorance; since I am not an expert on the LHP, I prefer to make sure something is correct with someone knowledgeable.But if you believe these questions are annoying or whatever I can stop altogether.

P.S. I was about to make a thread on will training and excercise / martial arts, I still can´t choose which one would be more suitable for that goal.
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#17 RoseRed

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Posted 29 November 2013 - 11:39 PM

View PostNameless, on 29 November 2013 - 08:08 PM, said:

My questions related to this subject, are for the most part, because I can´t claim an expertise on this area yet, even less with a path I am starting to fully understand. This thread was made to identify possible causes for the last thread related to the entities, and given that someone had some hate towards my mindset, to allow him/her to vent; I suffer not for being judged, so you need not to apologize.

Now despite you stating, the entities, could fuck up with me, I STILL, continued with the ritual I had scheduled.I do not feel weak, and I think they already know that, but, I wanted to make sure what the reasons for their visit was.

My questions are not made out of insecurity but rather of ignorance; since I am not an expert on the LHP, I prefer to make sure something is correct with someone knowledgeable.But if you believe these questions are annoying or whatever I can stop altogether.

P.S. I was about to make a thread on will training and excercise / martial arts, I still can´t choose which one would be more suitable for that goal.

First off - I didn't apologize. I just simply stated the fact that I was speaking without judgement.

I can only go by what you write. You stated that you wanted to boost your ego. Then I explained how that comes across. Whether it's insecurity or ignorance - I couldn't tell from the post.

I have no idea where you got the idea that I think your questions are annoying. If I thought you were being 'annoying' I never would've bothered to spend as much time as I did replying to your post. Naly used the words 'stupid and typical' but I'm the one you think finds your post annoying? Where did that even come from? I just don't get it.

To be perfectly clear - I think you take the time to think about what you're doing and asking and that that's a good thing. You're putting a lot of thought into what you're doing. You may not always like or agree with the answers that you get but there's been a lot of discourse in this thread. It's obvious that I'm not the only one that thinks this. I don't understand why you would be so willing to stop searching for your answers because you think that I think you're being annoying. (Which I don't, btw).

I think the thread on will/martial arts is a good idea. Martial arts will accomplish both and help with a lot of things on your list above as well. If you have any schools in your area - it might be a good idea to talk to the people that run them. This could help you have a better idea of what you can expect from the classes and then you can make a more informed decision on whether it's something you're interested in committing to.
When my wings get tired I grab my broom.

#18 Brennan

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 01:25 AM

0. 'Ain Soph' does not translate to 'Nothing'.

1. Boosting the ego doesn't make much sense to me. Lots of people have HUGE egos and nothing to back it up with. It makes more sense to me to boost confidence by increasing your capabilities; skills and knowlesge base. A huge ego without anything to back it up is a limitation to the accumulation of power. Destruction of ego does not make much sense to me either, for that matter.

2. Wisdom is the ability to implement knowledge. A person needs to understand the facts before they can use them.

3.Deities do not determine which direction a person takes. There are ample LHP'ers who bow before Gods, just as there are RHP'ers. That's personal preferance.

4. Critical thinking also is non-path specific. It can benefit anyone and is highly encouraged by most faiths, and professionals. In order to get certain degrees for example, you need learn the basics of critical thinking. Doctors, philosophers and engineers all utilize critical thinking.

5. A group of people working together has a greater chance of survival than an individual does alone. This is also Darwinian thinking.

I can't tell you what the Lhp is, just as I can't tell you what the right hand path is; people have two hands and to tie one behind the back seems foolish to me. What I can say is that hey're more akin to aims, goals and values, the paths, and not necessarily what is done or how a person goes about meeting them.

Edited by Brennan, 30 November 2013 - 01:33 AM.


#19 Curious Cat

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 02:01 AM

I personally choose to reject labels such as LHP and RHP. I am a human being trying to gain knowledge and to help others when I can, all other definitions feel much too unnecessary to me at this point in my life. Perhaps I am being too laconic with my explanation.

#20 ChaosTech

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 02:05 AM

Sounds to me like even the LHP will annoy you. You want a non-spiritual, but magical path. Both LHP and RHP as well as the middle way between extremes, all lead to Nirvana, or the dissolution of self into the mighty ocean of non-being. Relative lasts a while, absolute forever. Here is the trick the sages fear though, just how long is the absolute if it has no beginnings or ends, and so how long can the relative be, which does? It all exists out of choice, let those who wish to ruin themselves and reincarnate beyond belief, do so, let those who pursue dharma or right action, do so and return to Ain Soph, which is no-being, as we experience being, but actually true being, as it is sufferless. The rest of the folk can live or reincarnate as long as they wish, till they seek the life of return to Nirvana. This is not a race, the RHP just hates suffering, so wants us all to transcend our selves, and lift all of creation with us, as fast as possible. Everybody else, isn't so burnt out of suffering, and think it's worth it, maybe even so long it might as well be forever, even if there is no such thing, just beyond time. Do what thou wilt, that is all us mages need to live by, forget this RHP, LHP, middle way, bullshit. Or live your life accordingly, whatever is your will.

Edited by ChaosTech, 30 November 2013 - 02:06 AM.



For nearly 20 years I meditated on and studied that which has no name, but is absolute, infinite, beyond both small and large. Finally one day I realized the limits of my sentient consciousness. It has all power over whether we are it or dual. There is no choice of the nondual, for choice is dual. Just be, live, do what you will, with love and wisdom. As Hermes said, in a time yet unborn, all shall be one, and one shall be all. True enlightenment has nothing to do with attainment. It's an inner peace, that there is nothing to be done, I call it surrender to the Spirit.





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