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Australian Satanism + the Temple of THEM


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#21 ThoTh

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Posted 12 January 2010 - 01:16 AM

Hello,

It's been a while since anything was posted here due to an absence and re-organization of the Temple of THEM.

We have made many changes to our current following a three month hiatus - these changes have affected the relevance of many of our previous works and in most cases, earlier works by the Temple have become obselete.

The Temple of THEM presently associates itself with its own European Tradition of Sorcery rather than Satanim and direct body-based physis instead of the Form-based intellectual strategy for psycho-social collapse it used to be concerned with. (Former +O+ mss are now archived at Ryan Anschauung's Wordpress)

For those interested in our new current (or our old current), our 2010 Manifesto is available in part from our Wordpress.

ISS,
ThoTh

#22 ThoTh

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Posted 09 March 2010 - 10:35 PM

In leaving the Temple of THEM, and the ONA, I am now unimprisoned by their ideologies and free to express my own.

http://au.groups.yah...up/Sinister101/

#23 ThoTh

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 12:47 AM

I have established beyond doubt that I do not work well with others. Behind my literary achievements and physical explorations on the LHP, lies a road of
crumbling citadels where what could have been can never be all because of how destructive I prove to be to any form.

I worked with the Temple of Hel – but I proved too disruptive.

I worked with Ixaxaar - but proved too disruptive to them.

I worked with Integral Tradition Publishing – briefly – before I proved too
disruptive for them.

I tried to gain admission into the IOT – that bastion of chaos whose motto is
`Nothing is Forbidden, Everything is Permitted' but they refused me entry on the grounds that I was a Satanist from the ONA.

I tried to work with the Tempel ov Blood whose war-cries of Disruption,
Infiltration, and Destruction – aptly applied – served only to poison relations
between us forever more. Choronzon fall on your knees.

I tried to work with the MLO – but proved too disruptive for them too.

I tried to make my own way with Mvimaedivm, the Black Glyph Society, and the Temple of THEM: But I proved too disruptive and destructive even to myself.

Anton Long once said to me in a reply to my query of my forms clashing with
those of the then fledgling WSA: "There is no conflict, only the appearance of
conflict"

Yet, I've even proved too disruptive for that which so many honour as the Father of Diversity, that group which has made its name on calling for the practice of such activities and complains that the Magian seeks to silence its voice has tried to silence mine. Shugara get behind thee.

In all these groups there are rampant cries or support for others to practice
disruption, anarchy, chaos, destruction, acausality, go beyond good and evil, be evil, the sinister, indulge in deception, be a hard man, a new species, go
beyond the veils, and bring down the forms that obscure; the roar of propaganda forms a deafening cacophony.

But there is noticable irony in the fact that my energy proved -too- disruptive
for all of them and all of my many past employers, friends, associates and so
many things I have ever tried to do.

Dawned, the insight of this dynamic and the understanding that leads me to
believe that forms do not and can not represent the energies that they seek to define and control.

And that when people claim to desire the presence of certain energies – and
those energies present themselves – it turns out they actually meant something else…
Which – is what I've been trying to warn those asking for them of, all along. So many groups have urged me to go out and wreak unearthly destruction, rain death and disaster down upon the world and its inhabitants – and I have, rampaged, for years – but when I finally get to their door, the fuckers act surprised to see me!

Has no-one else ever noticed that the cries of war are heavily laden with
demands of obedience, control, loyalty, honour, family? That it's okay to be
sent to destroy and strive to be unlimited in power as befitting of a dark
master – so long as we don't destroy those who set us on the path? "Bring
Chaos!" many of them demanded of me – "hey wait, not actual chaos!", they all whispered, sooner or later.

I was surprised to hear more than one seasoned extremist ask me throughout my sojourn to not publish this or that, or subtly suggest that I keep my ideas to myself lest they prove too revealing – too disruptive.

For the longest time - I've feared my power and the compulsion to Be Myself.
The fear of escaping free to Be made me controllable and allowed me to be
persuaded to channel my energies into certain forms. I changed myself to fit
containers – fit expectations and imposed limits on what I was and what I was capable of to suit others.

I once pained over my destructive energy; watched it burn castles and
drawbridges with its raging inferno; felt guilt for what I was and what I did. I
anguished and lamented at my own nature to destroy everything it touched.

I'm free now though. Free.

I have now Chosen not to be ashamed of my destructive power; to finally embrace My power and revel in the fullness of My nuclear intensity and My will to power.
I now see what I didn't see. What they all saw, and feared. Me, Free.

A Spiritual Orphan of the LHP.

Whatever that means.

#24 ThoTh

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 12:49 AM

The Black Glyph Society is being revived once again to produce and supply rare LHP books.

http://blackglyph.wordpress.com/

#25 Starbeast

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Posted 23 March 2010 - 12:56 AM

ThoTh said:

I have established beyond doubt that I do not work well with others. Behind my literary achievements and physical explorations on the LHP, lies a road of
crumbling citadels where what could have been can never be all because of how destructive I prove to be to any form.

I worked with the Temple of Hel – but I proved too disruptive.

I worked with Ixaxaar - but proved too disruptive to them.

I worked with Integral Tradition Publishing – briefly – before I proved too
disruptive for them.

I tried to gain admission into the IOT – that bastion of chaos whose motto is
`Nothing is Forbidden, Everything is Permitted' but they refused me entry on the grounds that I was a Satanist from the ONA.

I tried to work with the Tempel ov Blood whose war-cries of Disruption,
Infiltration, and Destruction – aptly applied – served only to poison relations
between us forever more. Choronzon fall on your knees.

I tried to work with the MLO – but proved too disruptive for them too.

I tried to make my own way with Mvimaedivm, the Black Glyph Society, and the Temple of THEM: But I proved too disruptive and destructive even to myself.

Anton Long once said to me in a reply to my query of my forms clashing with
those of the then fledgling WSA: "There is no conflict, only the appearance of
conflict"

Yet, I've even proved too disruptive for that which so many honour as the Father of Diversity, that group which has made its name on calling for the practice of such activities and complains that the Magian seeks to silence its voice has tried to silence mine. Shugara get behind thee.

In all these groups there are rampant cries or support for others to practice
disruption, anarchy, chaos, destruction, acausality, go beyond good and evil, be evil, the sinister, indulge in deception, be a hard man, a new species, go
beyond the veils, and bring down the forms that obscure; the roar of propaganda forms a deafening cacophony.

But there is noticable irony in the fact that my energy proved -too- disruptive
for all of them and all of my many past employers, friends, associates and so
many things I have ever tried to do.

Dawned, the insight of this dynamic and the understanding that leads me to
believe that forms do not and can not represent the energies that they seek to define and control.

And that when people claim to desire the presence of certain energies – and
those energies present themselves – it turns out they actually meant something else…
Which – is what I've been trying to warn those asking for them of, all along. So many groups have urged me to go out and wreak unearthly destruction, rain death and disaster down upon the world and its inhabitants – and I have, rampaged, for years – but when I finally get to their door, the fuckers act surprised to see me!

Has no-one else ever noticed that the cries of war are heavily laden with
demands of obedience, control, loyalty, honour, family? That it's okay to be
sent to destroy and strive to be unlimited in power as befitting of a dark
master – so long as we don't destroy those who set us on the path? "Bring
Chaos!" many of them demanded of me – "hey wait, not actual chaos!", they all whispered, sooner or later.

I was surprised to hear more than one seasoned extremist ask me throughout my sojourn to not publish this or that, or subtly suggest that I keep my ideas to myself lest they prove too revealing – too disruptive.

For the longest time - I've feared my power and the compulsion to Be Myself.
The fear of escaping free to Be made me controllable and allowed me to be
persuaded to channel my energies into certain forms. I changed myself to fit
containers – fit expectations and imposed limits on what I was and what I was capable of to suit others.

I once pained over my destructive energy; watched it burn castles and
drawbridges with its raging inferno; felt guilt for what I was and what I did. I
anguished and lamented at my own nature to destroy everything it touched.

I'm free now though. Free.

I have now Chosen not to be ashamed of my destructive power; to finally embrace My power and revel in the fullness of My nuclear intensity and My will to power.
I now see what I didn't see. What they all saw, and feared. Me, Free.

A Spiritual Orphan of the LHP.

Whatever that means.

So you're evil and you plan to blow up the world. Do I hear a muwahahahahaha? Or is it perhaps that the human experience is not founded on the idea of raining chaos and destruction, but tempered with justice and love as well? I'm not surprised that everyone out there won't have anything to do with you, if you're this extreme.

Best of luck...don't run up against someone stronger than you who has more sense in their heads. I'd hate to see the results of that one.

:cool: 37
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/

#26 ThoTh

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Posted 26 March 2010 - 01:15 AM

So you're evil and you plan to blow up the world.

-?- No.

Do I hear a muwahahahahaha?

-?- No.

Or is it perhaps that the human experience is not founded on the idea of raining chaos and destruction, but tempered with justice and love as well? I'm not surprised that everyone out there won't have anything to do with you, if you're this extreme.

-?- It's interesting how something can be taken in so many ways, and in this case, not at all the way I meant it.

Best of luck...don't run up against someone stronger than you who has more sense in their heads. I'd hate to see the results of that one.

#27 Starbeast

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Posted 26 March 2010 - 01:18 AM

ThoTh said:

So you're evil and you plan to blow up the world.

-?- No.

Do I hear a muwahahahahaha?

-?- No.

Or is it perhaps that the human experience is not founded on the idea of raining chaos and destruction, but tempered with justice and love as well? I'm not surprised that everyone out there won't have anything to do with you, if you're this extreme.

-?- It's interesting how something can be taken in so many ways, and in this case, not at all the way I meant it.

Best of luck...don't run up against someone stronger than you who has more sense in their heads. I'd hate to see the results of that one.

Well....if you would mind explaining I would be more than happy to have a conversation about it. I'm confused, really. But yeah...the way you put it at first it came off very different than how you seem to mean it.

:cool: 37
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/

#28 ThoTh

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Posted 26 March 2010 - 03:24 AM

I am interested in why you have made the conclusions you have too. Can I chat with you in pm's.

#29 Starbeast

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Posted 26 March 2010 - 04:06 PM

ThoTh said:

I am interested in why you have made the conclusions you have too. Can I chat with you in pm's.

Talk out here, answer the question I asked if you like. I really don't have a reason to PM at this point.

:cool: 37
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/

#30 ThoTh

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 02:49 AM

I think you have interpreted what I have said through the filter of morality - and thus concluded the presence of a more sinister than thou attitude.

The freedom I am speaking of lies beyond simplistic good and evil tensions. It is neither - and is more subtle than both.

My understanding is disruptive to forms - whatever moral fibre they might be. Disruptive to form altogether and every convenience everything else stands on. Free from morality does not mean a descent into debauchery - it means an annihilation of the simplistic tensions that are used to cover fine esoteria of millions of colours with one bland paint. This can only occur with temperance and love - love being an absence of fear.

#31 Starbeast

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 02:51 AM

ThoTh said:

I think you have interpreted what I have said through the filter of morality - and thus concluded the presence of a more sinister than thou attitude.

The freedom I am speaking of lies beyond simplistic good and evil tensions. It is neither - and is more subtle than both.

My understanding is disruptive to forms - whatever moral fibre they might be. Disruptive to form altogether and every convenience everything else stands on.

Hmmm. So I'm still seeing it as you couldn't work well in a group - but that isn't a moral judgment on my part. I'm confused as to what you do mean...why would destroying all forms be worthwhile?

:cool: 37
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/

#32 ThoTh

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 03:51 AM

Merely because that is the subjective understanding I have come to.

Precisely why is an extremely difficult subject that I have been trying to explore and explain for a decade and covers thousands of pages of text.

My work.

I would just say, that you read it and interpreted it through moral tensions of good and evil - that are not what I intended, but inevitable because of the structure of our language.

#33 Starbeast

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 04:09 AM

ThoTh said:

Merely because that is the subjective understanding I have come to.

Precisely why is an extremely difficult subject that I have been trying to explore and explain for a decade and covers thousands of pages of text.

My work.

I would just say, that you read it and interpreted it through moral tensions of good and evil - that are not what I intended, but inevitable because of the structure of our language.

Hmmm....possibly so. I don't think it's a "good and evil" thing, but whatever ^^ What does worry me is what you plan to replace form with - or rather, how you plan to eliminate forms from the human system. The ONA fascinates me, but that line of thinking seems to have some logical issues I haven't squared away yet.

:cool: 37
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/

#34 enelesmada

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Posted 28 March 2010 - 06:46 AM

It seems as though Thoth is attempting to strip away forms in order to reveal the essence or root of the matter. Perhaps in a personal bid to overcome its influence.

I may well be wrong.

#35 Starbeast

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 04:03 AM

enelesmada said:

It seems as though Thoth is attempting to strip away forms in order to reveal the essence or root of the matter. Perhaps in a personal bid to overcome its influence.

I may well be wrong.

Perhaps so - but he never really mentioned that it would be a personal thing only. It seems like a lot of ONA-based talk is universal, and frankly IMO reminiscent of fundamentalist rhetoric. They may have some good ideas, but I still get a vibe of "blowing up the world" every time an ONA person comes on here >.>

That said, there's at least a 50% chance I'm wrong :P

:cool:
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/

#36 enelesmada

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 04:39 AM

Starbeast said:

They may have some good ideas, but I still get a vibe of "blowing up the world" every time an ONA person comes on here >.>


As of recent Thoth has claimed to have severed with the ONA. It *appears* to have been somewhat acrimonious.

One of his works - The Arte of Deception (a free download), may give added perspective.

http://www.lulu.com/...ception/8280095

As for blowing up the world - it's all Gaslighting. Nothing is what it appears.

#37 Starbeast

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 04:50 AM

enelesmada said:

As of recent Thoth has claimed to have severed with the ONA. It *appears* to have been somewhat acrimonious.

One of his works - The Arte of Deception (a free download), may give added perspective.

http://www.lulu.com/...ception/8280095

As for blowing up the world - it's all Gaslighting. Nothing is what it appears.

I shall read the PDF shortly, out of pure interest. In the meantime this quote seems to explain the whole thread:

Quote

As an infiltrator (I prefer Wanderer) of many groups by many means to obtain the necessary
information for me to piece together my puzzle – I have learned a formidable deal about the Arte
of Deception (AOD). Herein I present a few of my Insights regarding the AOD.

Yeah...you double-cross orders, using them for your personal gain. Then you act surprised when they kick you out - I'm not taking your side here ^^

But yeah...gaslighting, or whatever term you wanna use. Why not just speak plainly? What's to be gained from added drama? I'm not getting the impression that this atmosphere is a ritual trapping, or a mindset/paradigm feature. So I'm lost. Don't get me wrong, man...the ONA freakin' fascinates me, but I think it could do with a little more substance and a little less...how do I speak my mind and remain inoffensive here?...pretension, maybe?

:cool: 37
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/

#38 ThoTh

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 05:49 AM

Hi.

Firstly, any previous works by me under Ryan Anschauung or ThoTh have already and publically (see my wordpress) been relegated to historical use only. Please do not equate my past works with my present ones. -I-, am not Thoth, or Anschauung, or Kris, or Khk - though I might use their accounts I have dropped their personalities. When I left the Temple of THEM - I ceased to uphold the status quo, and that does not just mean a departure from belief, but an entirely new phenomenology that re-assesses everything. Unfortunately, in using words to convey messages, I enter a world where what I am doing is distorted - so I must fight to MAKE words say the right thing - though I am skeptical they can do that.

When IOT's idea of absolute chaos turns out to be a joke, when ONA's idea of chaos turns out to be a joke - what I actually am left with, is the insight that what people say always obscures what they are actually doing -especially when they explain what it is they are attempting to do. There is another level of communication, a wordless one, that is far more trustworthy than reading propaganda.


I wrote this recently to someone else:
It is difficult to understand where I'm at because I'm at a place before words begin. This - and all I do and write - is my phenomenology. It is not a reclusive retreat from criticism, or immune to comment; I intend to influence, but not directly, because I believe that each should impose their own will, and that letting others choose to impose it is the better of two evils. I fully understand the relationship of making comments and creating causal reactions - but there is more to it than merely understanding - one can operate on a variety of levels, unlimited levels, not just take a side and stick stubbornly with it as the one true way.

Anytime someone asks me a question - the put me in a position of answering it. They also use lots of words, and words, for me, are not as simple a device for communication as they seem - they mix up the original pure intent of the first writer's expressions. I believe my expressions should just hang in space and be picked up as they Are. I am in a place where I ask very few questions because I believe I am the only one with the answers for me. I also believe, by virtue of that insight, that everyone else is the only place where answers should be gotten for them.

But there is a subtlety in the transmission of ideas. I want to influence, but let others choose to be influenced by taking what I have to say for themselves - at that point, the communication is pure. But the moment they ask a question - or challenge a point made - or put forward a retranslation of my original point - they immediately detract from their own autonomy to seek validation. I believe that validation seeking is caused by the ego, and that the ego is not the only part of our consicousness, but that it is the dominant player who leaps to the front of the brain to ask questions only so it can validate its own entity - THIS, makes the ego STRONGER, and harder, to defeat - for the inside 'I' or core persona of a person to emerge. I believe we all have one - but our ego often trips us up and gets in the way of it. Esp when it comes to language, and morality.

-----------

This is part of my work - but it is not something with a clear end or a clear cut division. In attempting to eradicate forms - it is not an attempt to kill or reject them for what they are or what they do - but to place them in a different context, to move them to the side temporarily to see what is beyond them. There are worlds that lie beneath form that cannot be explored using forms or language or morality.

My post on irony is not about double-crossing forms - I did not do the same thing to disrupt each of these forms I cite, I disrupted them because I did not, could not believe in any of their ideals or the forms and beliefs they put forward, no matter what moral calibre they were of. I've also worked with 'good' moral-based groups (not cited) and done the same thing - the point I am trying to make, is that to get to what is behind forms, very strange steps must be taken.

I am not ONA, or THEM or anything else - all those things are forms that trap, that limit me and tell me what to do, even when they Claim not be something that does that.

Forms do have a use - but they also have a science. There is life beyond forms.

#39 ThoTh

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 07:31 AM

Starbeast - It's very difficult to relate my work in only a few sentences or even paragraphs. I'm not even sure it can be understood or condensed for that matter. Perhaps it is all a phenomenological nightmare and subjective psychosis - but by that token, if so, I would see nothing that differentiates me from anyone else.

I have just posted some further attempts to illustrate my approach on sinister 101 where I am attempting to relate my work in greater detail. Maybe it will help. Or maybe it will just make things so much harder.

messages #140-142 are the posts I refer to. Though I doubt that my work can be understood from these few posts and if people see it as a finished process with some ultimate point to make. It is an evolution of change I've recorded since I was young and it's certainly not finished yet.

Though I should point out, that ultimately, people understanding my work or not, won't stop me from doing it.

Edited by ThoTh, 29 March 2010 - 07:39 AM.
clarification


#40 Starbeast

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 01:15 PM

ThoTh said:

Starbeast - It's very difficult to relate my work in only a few sentences or even paragraphs. I'm not even sure it can be understood or condensed for that matter. Perhaps it is all a phenomenological nightmare and subjective psychosis - but by that token, if so, I would see nothing that differentiates me from anyone else.

I have just posted some further attempts to illustrate my approach on sinister 101 where I am attempting to relate my work in greater detail. Maybe it will help. Or maybe it will just make things so much harder.

messages #140-142 are the posts I refer to. Though I doubt that my work can be understood from these few posts and if people see it as a finished process with some ultimate point to make. It is an evolution of change I've recorded since I was young and it's certainly not finished yet.

Though I should point out, that ultimately, people understanding my work or not, won't stop me from doing it.

And kudos for that. Haters get you nowhere :) What's Sinister 101? Can I get a link? :)

I see now, kinda...you're going for the truth behind the forms. The secret hidden by years of dogma. You and the IOT, or myself, are not so far off in that regard.

However my question remains with regard to the IOT and the ONA - why seek absolute chaos? What of value is absolutely chaotic? Or are we speaking of "formless and void" rather than a swirling miasma of random thrashing in the dark?

Really, these last two posts not only help me understand you a great deal, but they make me think that your goals might be suited by a brief foray into chaos magic. Thank you for beginning to make sense - I guess you're not the ONA, but you yourself have some awesome ideas. :cool::thumbup:

:ninja: 37
AwesomeJon 37 unveiled: 04/06/10...the Conversation continues :) Xeper is no longer a useful concept - but Awesome still is.

Nothing stops me! I've got an awesome 'tude for an awesome dude and I'm actually seriously practicing...the world is within my grasp!

Call me Jon ^^

http://liberverendus.wordpress.com/ The action happens here....in the Book of Awesome! :D

And always remember...keep it heavy! \m/\m/





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